It’s Worse Because I Tried To Do the Right Thing

I feel so horrible for all the pain I have read about in these posts!! It breaks my heart so much that other women are having to go through the same hell I have, and most of them are so much worse.

I discovered my husband’s addiction after 14 years of marriage, finding out he was in a relationship with someone else the entire time we dated, (over two yrs) and after we were married. They only lost contact bc she stopped, not him. (She was also a in high school @ the time, which he claims he didn’t know, but yet he found her on a high school reunion website?) He claims he looked her up again bc I was having horrid anxiety problems he couldn’t help me with, so this is how he coped w/it.

I agreed to marriage therapy, and I was pretty much told to forgive and forget, could I not see how sorry he was for everything?? I wasn’t buying it. He lied about so much back when we were dating, he looks her up again, plus he had a bunch of other chats w/strange women, and I was supposed to buy it was an just a one time thing??

To complicate things, I hid some things from him, that I did eventually tell him about, and I never gave him any reason to think he couldn’t trust me again, and he has said over and over he knows that, he would then use that to deflect his stuff. Even though the therapist have said there IS a difference,and I know I did the right thing by telling him, I feel like it did nothing but make things worse in so many ways.

He would lie about the stupidest things, and I knew something didn’t feel right. We tried different therapists, and it was always the same thing, I was having trust issues, I was expecting too much from him (when he would shut down and leave me out of his life), but he had time for everyone and every hobby under the sun.

He admitted to porn on occasion, would not answer his cell if I was around, hid relationships with other women, there were calls on his cell from towns his company never did business with, tried to tell me I needed mental help for my suspicions, etc., but it was never enough to be concrete proof. He is also a computer guru, so he added me to his company’s network, without my knowledge, and was spying on my web pages once I started talking about divorce and stll denies it.

We did see a SA therapist, who didn’t buy as many of his lies, but she kept stressing all he could do was tell the truth, my trust issues were my problem, and he didn’t “have” to do anything he didn’t want to. That was all he needed to hear, and anytime the addiction came up, he would pull the “I don’t have to discuss this”, and run away. It was like the therapists didn’t seem to know all they were doing was giving him more ways to shut me out, and hide things from me. No one would tell him he needed to be an open book, or that he was making unhealthy choices and living in denial.

He would try to stand up to his family, and the one friend he had when they hurt him, and then after a few months, he would cave. But I would get the rages and outbursts. I made the mistake of confronting him as to why he always caved in to them, when they never had to apologize, and he point blank told me they were his REAL family, not me, (When six months earlier, they did some things to him that were very hurtful, and he said MY family was his real family) and that is now being twisted around, that I never wanted him see his family or friends.

I confronted him one night about wanting to know why he was using in private filter browsing on the computer, when he never did before, and he picked it up, smashed it on the floor, and then hit me. He spent the night in jail.

As a Christian, even after all of that, I still felt a strong urge to make my marriage work, so we exchanged some emails, where I told him he wasn’t coming back until I saw signs he was safe, and wanted to get his rages under control again, which he agreed to. He told me he was getting his own place, but there was no $$ coming out of our account showing that was happening, so I had a protective order extended to make sure he couldn’t come back, and had the court order marriage therapy, and he flipped!

He came to all of the therapy sessions angry, and very hostile. At one session he did talk about how good I was for him, and how much he changed for the better,and the time with me was his happiest ever, but the rest of them, he blamed me for everything, and kept telling the therapist I would just never leave him alone, and once again, he was told I kept pushing things. It was unreal! All I ever wanted were straight answers, and to stop having to wait in line behind everything else under the sun, and discuss how the addictions STARTED. (It’s like a double standard…if we ignore the behavior, we have no self esteem and are a doormat, and if we want answers and normal attention in a timely manner, we’re pushy!)

I was so willing to stand by him in spite of the addiction, if he would only get into treatment, not just go to two SA meetings and quit. He led me to believe he wanted to work on the marriage, and then shocked me by telling me he wanted a divorce, bc he would always be a liar and a cheat, and then left the session. When I emailed him wanting to know what that meant, and how he could do this, he fired off a very hurtful response.

Even though so many things in the email weren’t true, it still made me feel like dirt. My head knows the sweet, caring man I fell in love with was fake; he didn’t know how to be in a normal relationship once the truth came out, and I wouldn’t fall for all the stuff that used to work, that doesn’t stop my heart from being shattered into a million pieces.

My family was so thrilled I found such a wonderful caring husband, that would be there to help me as I grew old w/my disability, and he ended up hitting me, and has said he will fight having to pay me support bc he’s not getting screwed by another ex wife (but he can be friends with her now, when all I heard was how horribly she treated him.) even though he makes very good $$, and I get strictly disability, and will now loose my heath insurance that paid pretty much whatever I needed.

But I can’t say a thing to him about what all he’s done to me, or I get harassment charges, not him. I’ve watched every therapist feel bad for him, the two secular ones say I’m a codependant bc I’m letting his actions affect me (Uh, how could they not??) and the legal system doesn’t care, bc he didn’t beat me to a pulp.

No matter how much I pray for God to open my husband’s eyes to how heartless he’s become, and the addiction he denies, I’m the one that seems to keep getting screwed every time I turn around. So this is incredibly hard to deal with. You have no idea what a lifesaver your website has been, bc I was starting to feel like I really was screwed up for all of my reactions to my husband’s mind games.

I’m scared out of my mind bc of my financial situation, bc never in a million years did I think he would be so cruel. I didn’t ignore things just so I could have the security. I just don’t understand how things have ended up so much worse for me bc I tried to do the right thing and make my marriage work.

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Responses

  1. My heart aches for you. Absolutely aches for you.

    After reading your post, the only insight I can offer is, your husband’s addiction belongs to him. It is his to do what he wishes with it. Nobody gets a say on how he chooses to use his addiction. The nasty mood swings, the self pity, the blaming, the isolation, the rage, the lies, ummmmmmmmm they are all his. They belong to him, The deliciousness of his addiction. The filth that is swirling around in his brain. His preoccupation with sex, his lack of desire for intimacy, they are all his.

    You can’t take it from him. You can’t make him give it up. You can’t make him hate his addiction. He will love it for as long as he chooses. And, only he gets to decide when he will give up his addiction. Only he gets to say when he will work on his rage. Only he gets to decide if he will ever try to live a better life.

    That’s what the therapists are trying to tell you. You can’t make him change. The only person you can change is you. So, let’s continue our discussion and talk about you. Tell us what you are doing to make yourself feel good. Tell us what you need to do to get life going for yourself.

    We understand that you are hurt and hurting. We understand he is a cold insensitive emotionally immature man, who is unfit to be your husband. We understand you wish he would change. We understand that he isn’t willing to do so. We all know him, because we are all in relationship with someone very much like him. So, let’s talk about getting you back to happy! What is it going to take to get you happy again?

  2. Wish I could figure out how to put my responses under the people that make a reply. Can anyone give me instructions?

    Sorry my story was SO LONG!

    It did take me a long time to see I can’t fix this for him. Part of what made it so hard to see that I was trying to do it for him, was that he did lie for so long that it wasn’t a “problem”, it was just a one time slip, and so many therapists bought the story, and told me the same thing. So I had no clue what I was dealing with under the surface. Even after seeing an SA therapist, I feel like I’ve learned more about who he is, how he will tend to react, and what my frame of mind should be so I don’t get sucked into his traps, and the tools I need, than I did from all the therapists we saw.

    Them telling me “You can’t fix him, only he can do that” did nothing to help me. If they had told me, “Here’s how he’s going to react if he’s in denial. Here’s what he’ll do if he really wants to change. It will take you time to be able to tell the difference. Don’t try to figure this all out right away. Just because you are lost and aren’t sure of so much right now, doesn’t make you a coaddict. You didn’t pick him because you grew up like this, you picked him because he deceived you and hid this behavior from you.”

    Ever since I have found this website, and have read other sites that reflect the same attitude, that this is NOT my fault, I wasn’t a coaddict, that alone has done wonders for my outlook. It actually makes it easier to see the times I did goof, when I didn’t have a clue how to handle things. And now I don’t beat myself up over it like I had been doing before, bc the therapists made me out to be so horrible for doing what I had been raised to do, help your spouse in time of need. But I see now, that is in a normal marriage. Trying to apply normal marriage thoughts and ideals with an addict is useless. Give me a way to deal with abnormal, and then I stand a fighting chance.

    Just having listeing ears right now helps. So many people think when I want to talk, I need them to tell me he’s a train wreck right now, and someone else is waiting for me. I don’t want someone else. I want my husband to realize this will never go away, and picking a new wife won’t make things better. Just boggles my mind that he has a wife, that even after he hit me, I still see the good that could happen, and he’s throwing that away. What an idiot! He is a scared little boy inside, that doesn’t want to face up to everything he’s done, and admit he needs help. That’s the tragedy none of us understands as a spouse.

    I haven’t stopped praying for him, that he will see facing up to this isn’t the end of the world, but rather the beginning of so much of the healing he so desperately wants to calm those negative thoughts he’s told himself for years.

    Thank you for understanding and listening. I think once this settles in a little more, I’ll feel like doing more. I haven’t neglected myself, just kind of retreating right now. His divorce decison is too fresh, and I need time to grieve the fact he can toss me away so easily. My head knows it’s not bc of who I am, but who he is, but my heart hasn’t gotten the message yet. Thanks again!!

  3. Forgot to include, I can forgive the fact he hit me, but I’m being very careful. He is not allowed to come to our house w/out the police present, I would not go to his place at all, and I would only meet with him in a public location. He has alot to show me through him attending therapy that he is safe again from a non abusive standpoint, not even talking about his addiction denial.

  4. Dear MRiC

    I am so sorry you are going through this. Good for you for protecting yourself physically, though I know how much more difficult it is to protect oneself emotionally. I know that you’ve had bad experiences with therapists, and it’s terrible that they can sometimes do more harm than good; but I do hope that you’re able to find a competent one to help you through this painful time. I just wanted to wish you all the strength and support you need to get through this.

    Much love,
    Laya

    PS: I love the positivity and confidence behind your name – you’re not making a very good co-addict 🙂

  5. Thanks Laya & An Honest Wife!

    Trust me, positive is something that is hard to be right now! My heart knows I have done what I know is right to try and keep my marriage together in a healthy a way. But there is a part of me that wishes I would have kicked him out a few years ago when all this came to light, and he felt so ashamed about what I’d discovered. At least then he had a contrite heart. Now he is ticked off someone has “figured him out”, and won’t buy all the sobs of apology and change that worked so well before, and he’s making me pay for it.

    I have to remind myself constantly that even if this doesn’t turn out “right” or “fair”, stooping to his level won’t make me feel better in the end. I could never be friends w/him after this is over, after everything he has done to make me think I’m crazy and a horrible wife, but I’ll never have to look back and wonder if I did the right thing.

    I’m learning when you are dealing with this kind of living hell, there is no right or wrong answer. All we can do as a spouse is to keep ourselves as informed as we can, so that we don’t beat ourselves up wondering what the “right” answer is. I’m seeing no one can possibly look at us and tell us what we “should have done”. No one looks at the cancer patient who has an uncurable cancer and tells them after everything has been tried, “Well, THIS is the treatment plan you SHOULD have done, this is your own fault it didn’t turn out better.”

    We take the what we know, and try to make sense of a senseless situation, and that answer is going to be different for every single one of us.

  6. Dear MyRewardIsComing,

    My heart also aches for you. Let me say, when you said: “We did see a SA therapist, who didn’t buy as many of his lies, but she kept stressing all he could do was tell the truth, my trust issues were my problem, and he didn’t “have” to do anything he didn’t want to. That was all he needed to hear, and anytime the addiction came up, he would pull the “I don’t have to discuss this”, and run away. It was like the therapists didn’t seem to know all they were doing was giving him more ways to shut me out, and hide things from me. No one would tell him he needed to be an open book, or that he was making unhealthy choices and living in denial.” I found myself screaming at the screen. A therapist in the alcohol rehab my “husband” attended told my husband the same thing….that he didn’t have to discuss his sex addiction in group therapy. ARGH! He was going to live behind the mask even in group therapy. I was the one who told him he had to come clean with the group if he wanted the therapy to work.

    What is wrong with these therapists? Argh!

    Addicts are cruel, self-centered jerks. The only thing they care about is getting their next fix. See if social services providers can help you get into a safe house. You mention a disability…..the fact that he raised a hand to you should have been enough for the court to throw the book at him. I’m surprised they didn’t.

    Please stay safe. I wish you well….

    My best, Betty

  7. Thanks Betty!

    I am safe right now, as there are orders in place to keep him away from our home, and he’s throwing our marriage away, so I don’t worry about him stalking me. He’d much rather spend his energy finding someone new that doesn’t know the real him.

    I know the responsibilty rests on my husband, and the fact he’d rather live in denial; it’s not the therapists fault. But again, when we wives go to therapy and we are trying to explain how we’ve been lied to, how twisted everything has become, that we don’t know what is REAL anymore, why does it become our mess to untangle and decifer? I guess I must be missing something, because it didn’t help one bit to hear, “He has his program to work, and you have yours. If you don’t trust him, you have to work on letting that go.”

    UMMMM…..What part of “I live w/a LIAR” did you NOT HEAR?? Does your office have a magic power that suddenly this is going to stop NOW??!! LOL!! I understand no matter what the therapist tells them, they will lie if they want to lie, I just wish there would be more time spent stressing just how LONG it’s going to take to rebuild trust, and that if they are going to use the tools they are given to manulipate, or constant avoidance, it will only continue to damage everything.

    I think of when I was in college, if I wrote a paper, or did an assignment incorrectly, I received a poor grade, but kept coming to class to LEARN and be TAUGHT how to apply what was being taught, CORRECTLY. So why does it feel like when we go to therapy, (because we want to LEARN how to get through this as a couple!), it’s like the therapists are afraid to tell the one causing the most damage how to CORRECT anything? We’re coming to class to hear all about how SA affects both of us, but they are too afraid to tell the SA how to start correcting things. Then we’ll start to feel more comfortable as we see this start to happen. Am I alone feeling this way??

    Oh, I was shocked to find out the legal system is pretty much the same way. Even though I had evidence of his temper, because I didn’t report it to the police, none of that mattered. They looked only at what had been reported. Since he didn’t fit the “profile” of a repeat abuser, I was told it would be pointless to try to take any other action against him other than keeping him away from our home.

    See what I mean when I say every time I turn around, he comes out ahead??

    1. Dear MyRewardIsComing,

      Throughout this process, (the marriage counseling in year 8 of our marriage, the marriage counseling in year 14 of our marriage, the counselor he saw for sex addiction in year 23, the counselor I saw to help me deal with my sex addict husband in year 23, the marriage therapist we see in years 24 and 25) I’ve come to believe therapists are quacks until proven otherwise. The vast majority of therapists have been taught that you are co-dependent and you have issues. Once they learn that you are married to a sex addict, they automatically label you. Pfft to that.

      I am re-reading “Your Sexually Addicted Spouse” by Barbara Steffens and Marsha Means. The first time I read it, I was in so much pain that I just devoured the book so quickly not a lot of it stuck. I’m re-reading it now and the wisdom of what they have written is coming through this time. I just finished the chapter on finding a good therapist, one who specializes in dealing with the spouse of a sex addict and is fully schooled in the trauma model. Sounds like that is what you need. You need a therapist who “gets it.” He needs a therapist that is not afraid to hand it to him on a platter. BUT, if the therapist did what needs to be done, clearly, directly, unequivocally, he would never go back. I think that is why therapists walk on eggshells with the addict. The “co-dependent” is supposedly a people pleaser, and won’t assert herself and won’t walk out of the therapists office. I really think that is why we get the short end of the stick. It’s WRONG, but it’s reality. Pfft to that again.

      Throughout the years, I’ve instinctively known something was wrong, instinctively developed a hard shell, instinctively developed the ability to ignore the bull shit he peddles, see the reality and truth (despite his attempts to gas-light me), and developed the ability to hand it to him on a platter. I know that I am a stronger person today because of what I’ve been through, but I don’t kid myself about the state of my “marriage” or the fact that I’m married to a self-centered 12 year old. I know I don’t fit the “co-dependent” model. I suspect you don’t either. I am learning to be especially sensitive to all the things he tries to blame on me. It sounds like your SA and your therapist is attempting to blame you, make you believe it’s your fault. When you said: ” He claims he looked her up again bc I was having horrid anxiety problems he couldn’t help me with, so this is how he coped w/it.” I cringed for you. My husband initally tried to blame me for his sex addiction too. Pfft. My response to my “husband” when he tries this now is: “NICE TRY, SWING AND A MISS ASSHOLE, here’s the deal…..” You’re anxiety arose because you instinctively knew something was wrong. He’s trying to reverse cause and effect. Please don’t allow it. Please find a good therapist….doesn’t sound like you’ve got one yet.

      My best, Betty

      1. Sorry Betty I was trying to attach this to MRIC’s comments!

      2. Betty,

        Thank goodness! I thought it was just me!! Sometimes I almost wonder if, bc my husband flew off the handle so much in our last therapy sessions, if maybe the therapist wasn’t a little frightened of what he might do to her office or her, and that’s why she as you say “walked on eggshells” w/him. It’s hard not to wish that had been a little different, and more had been said that this wasn’t my deal to start with.

        I know you are still married, and while we where married, I did feel my husband trying, but when I kept seeing things weren’t really getting any better, even though it was never anything concrete, but things like not answering his cell phone if I was around, or deleting all his calls and txts, the usual I’m sorrys and sob stories didn’t work anymore, so that’s when he got physical.

        I know the way I spied and other things weren’t normal in a marriage, so I see where he got frustrated. But after he had to leave, I still reached out to him to try to fix this in a healthy way. Now he’s turned everything into how I hurt him. He’s refusing to work on any of the issues w/his family and his past, that got all this mess started, even though I’ve told him I’m not holding it against him, I’m trying to understand.

        My head gets that he’s being a jerk. He seems to think hitting me wasn’t any big deal I would have to forgive, but he can’t forgive what I did to him years ago, or see I’m trying to change, even though I don’t really know anymore what is the “right” way, or “wrong” way to be married to a sex addict anymore, and I’m tired of trying to figure it out. I can just be the wife I know how to be.

        But he’s having no part of it. My head knows it’s bc he is still in denial, my head knows it’s all up to him, and he’s refusing, my head knows I can’t MAKE him do anything, my head knows he’s just deflecting all his crap unto me so he doesn’t have to deal w/what he’s done, (bc a SA can’t ever stand to feel bad about what they do), but I’m curious if any of you ladies out there can tell my heart how much longer it will take for it to catch up to what my head knows??

        Right now my heart feels like I’ve done everything wrong, it’s all my fault, if only I had done things differently, none of this would be happening. That’s where I’ve felt my lowest, was when the secular therapists started talking about this coaddict stuff, hubby made it more my fault this was happening, and I started to believe it.

        So is my heart ever going to catch back up to my head, and know this isn’t all my fault?? That he is in denial and refuses to see what we could have, and he’s running from what he knows he has to work on. Is my heart ever going to get through this?? Why can’t my heart think like my head???!! No amount of things I do for myself changes things, so it’s not that I neglect myself or ever have, I just can’t believe this is turning out to look like he’s the “good guy” in all this mess, from someone who I never dreamed would be this way.

        Please make my heart understand what my head gets!!

      3. Dear My Reward is Coming,

        I am trying to change my self-talk in an effort to help my heart catch up to my head. You are absolutely correct in your assessment that your husband is deflecting blame on to you to avoid self-examination.

        I really can’t stress enough how much they rely on this tactic to keep us down and off balance. Please do not allow it. NONE OF THIS IS YOUR FAULT. NONE OF IT.

        Whenever my husband does something, I used say to myself “Well, you married him moron.” STOP. I married a man that did not exist. I married a carefully crafted mirage, a facade, an image that he projected quite convincingly to me, my family, to friends. NO ONE KNOWS how he treated me in private, how he sneered at me at every opportunity, how he blamed me for everything. STOP. GAME OVER. I now say: “You were conned by one of the best. You fell prey to a common con artist. Extricate yourself from the “marriage.” Your every word, thought and deed needs to be dedicated to removing yourself from the marriage.”

        You know the truth……please try to construct positive, life affirming responses/replacements to and for your negative self-talk. See if that helps your heart catch up to your head. This seems to be helping me to feel better.

        My best to you, Betty

    2. I know the responsibilty rests on my husband, and the fact he’d rather live in denial; it’s not the therapists fault. But again, when we wives go to therapy and we are trying to explain how we’ve been lied to, how twisted everything has become, that we don’t know what is REAL anymore, why does it become our mess to untangle and decifer? I guess I must be missing something, because it didn’t help one bit to hear, “He has his program to work, and you have yours. If you don’t trust him, you have to work on letting that go.”

      It sounds like the therapist is saying that your hubby is not going to solve your problem for you. You want him to stop lying to you. He’s not going to. He lies. He’s fine with lying. It doesn’t hurt him one bit. He lies. He’s going to continue to lie. The therapist can’t make him tell you the truth. You can’t make him tell you the truth. You know he’s lying, so the next move is up to you. You want him to tell you the truth, but you can’t make him do that and he doesn’t want to do that. So the program you have to work is yours…..you have to figure out how to live your life without any truth telling from him. There is no point in focusing on “oh, if he would only tell the truth.” That’s not what SA do. So, there’s no point in wishing and hoping and believing that a therapist can change that. The only person that is going to stop him from lying is him, and it sounds like he’s not interested. So the therapist is saying, ” stop worrying about getting him to tell the truth. Stop worrying about getting him to play nice. Stop worrying about how he can treat you so badly. He is an SA and he is doing what SAs do.”

      UMMMM…..What part of “I live w/a LIAR” did you NOT HEAR?? Does your office have a magic power that suddenly this is going to stop NOW??!! LOL!! I understand no matter what the therapist tells them, they will lie if they want to lie, I just wish there would be more time spent stressing just how LONG it’s going to take to rebuild trust, and that if they are going to use the tools they are given to manulipate, or constant avoidance, it will only continue to damage everything.

      The therapist understands very well that you are living with a liar. The therapist is also aware that any talk of rebuilding trust with a liar is probably not rational. It sounds like you are interested in rebuilding trust, but your husband is not. He wants to continue lying. It sounds like you are interested in his using “tools” but your husband is not. It sounds like you are interested in his getting well, but he is not. In the meantime, where is the planning for your life? Where are you going to live? How has this marriage affected you? What is your recovery plan for the betrayal? How do you make sure you never fall for another emotional 12 year old? How did it even happen that you married an emotional 12 year old? I ask these questions of you just as I ask them of myself. How in the HE!! did I miss the fact that my husband was so emotionally immature? How did that happen? What grown woman marries a 12, 13 14 year old? What was on our mind? What were we thinking?

      I’m more interested in finding out those answers than getting an answer to ” when is he going to stop lying?” I know the answer to that question. He’s going to stop lying when HE gets good and [email protected] ready to, and not one moment before. The therapist is saying get with a program that focuses on improving YOUR life. How’s your health? How much time are you spending laughing with your friends? Are you reading good books? Are you listening to good music? Do you have pictures that make you feel good on your walls? Do you have live plants in the house? How is your spiritual connection? Are you being creative?

      One thing we all know for sure. Those little boys are well schooled in taking care of themselves. We need to steel our nerves and get focused on taking care of ourselves and be ready to live with or without them. I’m just sayin”

      1. I can so greatly appreciate your comments! You were very blunt and direct in your comments and questions. That’s sort of my whole point. The therapist ISN’T telling me I’m living with a liar. The way they are phrasing things, they are saying he IS working on his program, and I’M the one with the trust issues. Why can’t they instead look at him and say “Your wife wants to trust you want to change things. All you can do is tell her the truth, BUT you have to actually FOLLOW THROUGH with then telling the truth. If you keep lying, how to you expect her to ever believe you??”

        I KNOW he can just as easily lie no matter what way it’s phrased. I KNOW I can’t MAKE him change. My frustration has been that it feels like so much time is spent on telling me right from the very start how to detach my feelings for a man I promised to be with, for better or for worse, and how to live my live preparing for what I’m going to do if that doesn’t happen, as soon as a I walk in the door.

        I do take care of myself, and I do things I enjoy. Those things are wonderful, but they don’t give me tools to deal with my husband’s addiction. I get what they mean, and I understand where they are coming from, I just wish the therapists would spend a little less time telling us how to “detach” and create our own peaceful worlds while we are in the middle of hell.

        Explain to our addicts upfront they are not horrible, but their ACTIONS against us ARE. Explain to both of us this won’t get better overnight, it is going to be a lifelong struggle for the addicts. Tell us what a REAL desire for treatment looks like, and what a fake one looks like. Explain we wives are going to be in “police” mode for a while. Once we see they are really trying to get better, that mode will probably subside, and THEN we can work on how to build trust back into the relationship.

        I GET they may just be playing more games with us. I just want the therapists to call THEM on the carpet when they see the blameshifing, the avoidance, the denial, the lies, etc,. If they KNOW it’s going on, then why can’t they call the addict on it, so it’s brought to their attention??!

        If I see nothing is changing, nothing is any different, then HE knows he can’t go back to therapy and “fool” someone else. Someone else has seen through his facade. I know this is oversimplifying things, but if one person tells me I make lousey coffee, but no one else ever does, I might blow off the person that always harps on my lousey coffee. But if 20 people tell me that, I might be more likely to look at how I need to change the way I make coffee. Or I might just keep making lousey coffee. But I might be more open to suggestion if it isn’t always something the same person complains about. There’s more validity to the claim.

        If my husband had been given a very direct way to begin the healing process, and I knew exactly what to look for, then I can see exactly where you are coming from. At that point, then I do need to deal with the reality of the situation, not what I wish it was. Then give me tools for how to deal with things depending on how I decide I want to deal with my new reality, whether I stay or go.

        I go back to my house example, it’s NOT that I think I can change the realtor who sold me a house so different from what I thought I was getting, I would just like to see some time spent focusing on how HE can make ammends, and keep this from happening again, and THEN I’ll deal with the reality of the situation, whatever that ends up being. But can we please spend SOME time focusing on what THEY DID WRONG, instead of how wrongly we handle everything, right off the bat?

        As to why I married him, and what was I thinking, it was because I fell in love with a man who LIED to me about who he was and what he was doing behind my back, that he knew would cause me to leave him, so he HID IT! It wasn’t bc of any need I did or didn’t get growing up. I didn’t grow up with abuse. I’m a helper by nature. I’m not going to kill that part of me bc of what HE did to me. Will I be extremely nervous if I ever date again that this will happen again?? Heck yeah!! I’m afraid of “thinking” again that I’d be dating someone who was kind, caring, and would be a wonderful husband.

        I’m sorry if I sound rude, I don’t mean to be, but I thought that was sort of the whole point of this website, was to stress we DIDN’T do anything to “pick” these addicts like the “codependant theory” wants us to believe. Again, I do appreciate you didn’t “code” what you were telling me, I just wish more therapists were this direct with the ADDICT.

      2. It sounds to me like you’re trying to get marriage counseling and sex addition therapy accomplished by the same therapist. The issues you expressed that the sex addiction therapist is not handling sound like marriage counseling issues. It might be worth a conversation with the therapist to discuss the difference between what is being offered and marriage counseling.

        From a sex addiction therapy perspective, the advice to have a Plan to move on if he doesn’t respond to treatment is spot on. that’s not what you want to hear from a marriage counselor, but nothing wrong with a SA therapist suggesting that. Leave the addict and his addiction alone. God knows you don’t want to have to climb into that brain and sort things out.

        I’ve got 16 months into this nonsense. I once worried about all the things you are worried about. I can tell you, there’s nothing for you down that path. They change what they want to change. I have a question. How much of his day does he spend worrying about how you are getting better? Does he make recommendations for your recovery? Does he worry about what you’re telling or not telling the counselor? How does he advise you regarding what you need to do? What does he think of YOUR situation? C’mon now. If he’s not spending time worrying about your emotional health………..

        I”m still stuck on how I managed to marry someone so emotionally stunted? What the hell was I thinking? Regardless of what lies he told, and what facade he presented, I want to understand how I could’t recognize a facade from reality. Those questions are much more interesting than ‘why doesn’t the therapist call him out?” Everybody in the room knows he lying. Everybody in the room knows that addicts are liars. So what’s the point?

      3. an honest wife,
        You will drive yourself crazy trying to figure out how you didn’t see through the facade, lies, deceit, manipulations, betrayal and every thing else. You are also correct in the fact that they don’t even worry about what this has done to your life.

        I have had the same things haunt me. You know what, I didn’t grow up in a family that lied to each other, covered up, brushed things under the carpet, in my family we were kind, loving, truthful, and forthright. In my make-up and life, I can’t even begin to understand how someone could do the things he has done and have no consciousness about it. But, they do, and don’t even blink their eyes. They are souless, ruthless and devoid of any human values.

        The SA I was married to is, was, and will always be a master liar. He and his family, they participlate in the lies, mama just brushes it under the carpet. When he writes in his story, I could be gone all day and she (mother) would never ask where I had been, might pose a question where someone would ask her about that. It is easier for mama to sweep that under the carpet, than to answer that.

        I think these individuals seek out someone who has the values, moral codes and ethics that they are so sorely missing, hoping that it will rub off on them, or, they can steal them from you. You are trying to understand this from your perspective and how you live and deal with things in your life – they don’t even come close to values, honesty, integrity or anything that is fair, truthful or human.

        It is not worth the time to try to figure it out, there is no explanation good enough, soothing enough, that can make up for what they have done. I have changed my view on humanity, some people are just human trash with nothing in them of redeeming value. The sad thing in this (sex addiction) is that more time will be spent on helping them than spent on the people whose lives have been completely torn apart. We have to “man-up”, and pull it together, even though we had nothing to do with it.

        Some people on this site, they saw hints or had inklings of a behavior (they didn’t understand) before they married, for others there was no behavior that was even on the radar. Those are the ones (SA) who are really dangerous, because you can’t look back and say, there was this or that and I should have realized that it didn’t add up. It plain and simple is deception and you will never figure that one out.

      4. Honest,

        Jeanette is right about not blaming yourself for the “How Could I Not See This” part you are blaming yourself for. I see I am a helper by nature, so if I ever date in the future, should this divorce go through, and he starts talking about a bad relationship with his family, sorry, that’s a big red flag for me now. So I can see certain things that might have been hints, but if were that easy to figure out and spot, would so many of us be where we are??

        She also mentions something else that hit home for me. When we were dating, he used to tell me he loved the fact I had such strong values. But then if I question how he can do some of the things he does that aren’t always porn/sex related, he tells me I shouldn’t “judge” him. One of the therpists did share w/me, part of why won’t ever understand how he could do all this, is bc I would never do things like this.

        If there are “red flags” you can look back and see that might have been some hint, I have no doubt they will big giantic red banners in the future, bc you’ve been lived it. That’s where I felt part of my lowest, was at one point, I had another therapist tell me bc I saw a few hints before we got married, I knew what I was getting myself into, I married what I was familar with. I spent weeks beating myself up. Like Janette, my family could not have been more different than his.

        It wasn’t until I started finding sites like this that showed me an opposite viewpoint that I DIDN’T know, and wasm’t a co addict that I started to feel some relief.

        LOL! Maybe they need to have two types of couples therapy for SA couples. If you married your SA because you grew up thinking you deserved to be treated this way, we offer Program A, and if you married your SA with very few or no clue what you where getting yourself into – We offer Program B, bc they are both on SUCH opposite ends of the spectrum, and treating both the same way didn’t seem to help many of us.

      5. Ladies, here is a copy of an email I sent to my therapist: Let me know what you think.

        ,

        In our recent sessions terminology from the co-dependency/co-addict model have crept into the discussion. I am writing to again state my objection to being referred to as a co-addict or co-dependent to XYZ’s sexual addiction. As I have previously mentioned, I find the terms co-addict and co-dependent inaccurate, insulting and offensive. Separately, I find Carnes’ work sorely underdeveloped. I am again respectfully requesting that you refrain from applying those labels to me, in session. I am also requiring that those terms not be used to label (young daughter) and requesting that they not be used to label (20 year old daughter).

        I respect your training in the co-dependency model. I also accept that for many years therapists relied on that model as the sole theoretical approach to explaining the relationship between a sex addict and spouse, however, this is no longer the case. As argued by Dr. Barbara Steffens and others, the relational trauma model provides a much stronger logic model for examining the ” intense psychological distress, irritability and attempts to control the environment” exhibited by the betrayed spouse of a sex addict.

        After more than 25 years of making the same argument, the Carnes model remains one big tautology. Every conceivable behavior by the spouse is recognized as a true instance of co-addiction. If one spouse argues with the sex addict, she is a co-addict. On the other hand, if another spouse does not argue with the addict, she is a co-addict. Installing porn blockers makes one wife a controlling co-addict while not installing porn blockers makes another wife a co-addict in denial. Tautology, it doesn’t matter what the behavior, it meets the definition.

        This model is damning when applied indiscriminately to every woman who walks in shocked and seeking help. It is particularly distressing to have its misuse perpetuated by other women. Wives need therapists who are not looking at them through the eyes of an addict or people trained to articulate the problem in the voice of the addict. This problem has a female voice, which deserves to be heard and not run through the filter of the sex addict and the people who support them.

        I respect your work. I respect that the Carnes model is what you have been trained in, however I again ask you not to refer to me in session as one who knew the behavior was occurring and enabled it.

        With many thanks

      6. Honest,

        Just my two cents, but I say well done! I could not agree more with how you gave examples of how no matter how we choose to handle a situation, we are co addicts, and it’s very frustrating from where we sit!

        Sometimes it feels like some therapists think if we question some of the things they tell us, we don’t respect their professional training and expertise. I’ve had one of them tell me he is not used to a client who questions so much about what we discuss. Isn’t that part of what a healthy person is able to do, is question things that don’t apply to their situation? Why is it that part of what therapy teaches is to stand up for yourself , but when you do it w/them, that’s not correct?

        I know I sound down on therapists, and I promise I’m not. I have learned some valuable skills they have taught me, that has helped me SO MUCH in other situations. The difficult part of this, is as our husbands argue their actions, we see their denial of acceptance they are an addict, so when we when argue the co addict model, gee, guess what that says about us from the therapist viewpoint? I know they don’t have a crystal ball that tells them no, this person isn’t in denial.

        But even when my husband kept saying over and over, “She used to not do this, or she used to not be this way”, then how does that fit the pattern of a co addict that always had these behaviors? It was so frustrating!

        I felt so lost when I was almost scolded for questioning my husband when I’d run across things that didn’t make sense, or wanted to discuss things with him, and was told those were his issues, that was my controlling behavior coming out. I could almost see my husband laughing that he had gotten a free pass. There were so many situations I felt that bc I stood up for myself, and wasn’t allowing my husband to blow me off when things didn’t make sense, that was the “wrong” thing to do, but if I ignored it, that was also “wrong”. I was miserable, bc no matter what therapist I turned to, I was a huge part of the problem, even though he had it before he met me. I guess they were right, there was something wrong w/me.

        Then I started finding sites like this one that breathed some life back into me again. I can never thank women like everyone on here, and the therapists who DID see something was wrong with how we were being treated, and have started to change things.

        So I think your letter is wonderful Honest! You may want to reference therapists like Marsha Means and others who are using the trauma model, maybe your therapist will into it, and consider this as well because of your letter. Good luck!

      7. Dear My Reward Is Coming,

        When you say: “I just wish the therapists would spend a little less time telling us how to “detach” and create our own peaceful worlds while we are in the middle of hell,” I ask you to consider if the therapists aren’t suggesting that we employ the same coping mechanisms the addict employs. The addicts detach from reality and go to their “happy place” …..a fantasy. I refuse. I have repeatedly said to our marital therapist: “I am a real, earthly woman with real, earthly need to deal with the trauma inflicted by my husband’s sex addiction. I need real, earthly suggestions for dealing with the pain, dealing with the times when something triggers a memory and I’m taken right back to the active, immediate hell of the situation.” Her response to me: “Offer it to Jesus. He is more than willing to stand in and take your pain away.” Bull shit. Where was this Jesus person when all of this was going down in my life? The all-knowing, all-powerful Jesus let this happen and NOW he’s going to step in and take the pain away? BULL SHIT. I refuse to participate in a fantasy.

        Reality is a scary place……even for therapists.

        My best to you, Betty

      8. Please tell your therapist to revisit Jesus the night before his betrayal. In Gesemane He was in such anguish that He sweat blood. He begged His Father to take away the pain he felt. Jesus did not get a free pass on pain and nobody miraculously intervened to shift His mind to a happy place. Your therapist needs to back up and actually study the bible before giving biblical advice. The story of Jesus is NOT that He swoops in, kisses your boo-boo and makes it all better. The miracle of Jesus is that it doesn’t matter that these fools we married allowed themselves to be used as tools of Satan, we took the worst they had to throw at us and survived. Jesus doesn’t take you out of the Desert and place you into an air conditioned suite at The Beverly Hills Hotel, complete with a young handsome cabana boy. Nope. He just makes sure we make it out of the desert. And once we’ve made it out of the desert, we will know we can do anything! All we need to do is not give up. As we journey, from time to time, we are going to find little treats. A little something that gives us courage to continue just a little bit longer. And then one day we are going to take a final look back over our shoulder and decide there is absolutely nothing back there of interest to us. Then we will need to all get together and have the world’s greatest coming out party! We will need some tee shirts, some hyped up music, balloons, confetti and lots of dessert! We can have it at my house!!

      9. Even though I am a Christian, I can relate to what Betty said, and also see alot of what Honest says, bc I think alot of when Jesus was betrayed. I turned my back on my faith for almost two years, bc it was very hard to believe any of the promises I had always believed. I knew God wouldn’t give me all my heart’s desires like a giantic Pez dispenser, and I knew we all had trials, but it continues to be difficult to trust, when I see a soon exhusband live in denial, who hates me, and is making things so hard for me, have no roadblocks come his way.

        Every single inch of this mess, every single time I have tried to correct where I need to correct things about myself, or reached out to him, when I could have just as easily slammed the door on everything so many times, and it the worst ever. I sit here scared to death as to how this is going to turn out, while he doesn’t have a care in the world. I know God understands why my faith is hanging on by a thread, and that may be why this is such a hard journey for me now, as a curb He has given me.

        Sometimes I wonder if the people who don’t understand why someone questions their own faith or beliefs, whatever they are, are people who have never really had their own severly tested?

    3. MRIC hang in there!! One of my favorite bible verses is Galatians 6:7: be ye not deceived God is not mocked for whatever a man soweth that shall he also reap. Also the bible very cleary says not to envy the wicked because they are going to be cut down. As badly as I have been mistreated, I would rather be me than him. Or as I have told him on numerous occasions ” it sux to be you.”

  8. Ladies,

    You have all been such a strong support system for me right now, and for that I will be forever grateful! Right now I am very afraid. My husband is moving forward w/the divorce, and I know it is going to be nasty. He has a great job, I am on disability, so I need support from him, it’s not something I am doing to stick it to him. He has said several times he’s not getting screwed, even given my situation. I don’t want to make this nasty, what’s the point if it’s over, why spend so much $$ for more disagreements?? I’ve never been through this before. I still pray for a miracle, but I’m running out of hope. I just can’t believe this is part of God’s plan, to see a marriage destroyed. I have tried so many times to reach out to my husband, to try to change what I need to change about me, and not one bit of it did any good. Made things worse. If the marriage can’t be saved by some miracle, do I have any hope that the divorce won’t have to be so horrible??

  9. An Honest Wife,

    Bravo.

    This is exactly what i told my SA.

    Inspite of the hell that i have been thru,inspite of the days which i thought i wouldnt be able to get thru ,inspite of the nights when i wished i didnt have to open my eyes the next morning ,inspite of the soul destroying pain and inspite of the so called “fun” lifestyle of his..i always thanked God that in this macabre dance i wasnt in his place…coz even in the throes of despair i knew i would eventually be out of this hell someday coz though my mind and heart were destroyed my soul wasnt.Whereas maybe his heart and mind were not as damaged but his soul was totally destroyed.

    Even if he recovers he would always be living on the precipice.In this life he would always remain an addict whether he acts out or not.Shudder.

    If at all one of us had to be an addict ,i am grateful to God that it wasnt me.

  10. My Reward…

    Wait a sec…

    I just read more.

    “I confronted him one night about wanting to know why he was using in private filter browsing on the computer, when he never did before, and he picked it up, smashed it on the floor, and then hit me. He spent the night in jail.”

    Honey… its worse than I thought. He smashed your computer and then he hit you?

    Since he spent the night in jail. (only one night?) I assume that you called 911???

    Honey, he is a SOCIOPATH.

    God IS watching out for you… now, about your heart… I get that completely. It will take time and it might be a long time, but eventually, when you get out from under and begin to find your true self, he will begin to make your skin crawl and you will feel creeped out that he ever had his slimy hands all over your lovely body. It will happen, so please pamper your beautiful self. Love YOU more. He cannot love. He is incapable of this. He is only capable of hurt. That is all.

    Try this perhaps. Do one thing new. Just one thing. Change one thing. I have found this helpful when I feel stuck and like I cannot cope. And please find a good therapist to help you reconcile all of this if you haven’t already.

    You did nothing wrong. absolutely nothing wrong. He was supposed to have protected you and he did not… and you were only trying to protect yourself and that is NORMAL! He is the one who is ABNORMAL!!! So, please say this to yourself a 1000 times a day.

    “I DID NOTHING WRONG.”

    hugs and love,

    Lexie

    1. Thanks Lexie & Sanity!

      It’s strange, after all of this first happened, after he hit me, I was glad the nightmare was finally going to be over. After he hit me, he acted like he still had every right to stay in our home. After I called the police, then the begging and pleading started, with statements that where mind games to try to get me to change my mind. I knew this wasn’t someone that was safe to be with anymore. (Yes, he only spent one night in jail) After he was gone, and I had to pack up his things since he was not allowed to come back to our home, that’s when I started to remember all of the good times we had. All of the times he would be honest and pour his heart out to me, and let me see how much he had been hurt. That was the man I fell in love with. The guy who wasn’t afraid to be vunerable. The guy who could freely admit he’d had a rotten childhood, and hated what his parents had put him through (Never any physical abuse, but sounded like lots of verbal abuse), but he’d never told them how he felt. I watched for years as his family ignored his value, and almost dismissed him.

      My heart still aches for him over all of that! That’s why my heart is having such a hard time right now. My head knows so much of this has NOTHING to do w/me. Most of this damage was done in his childhood. It wouldn’t have mattered who he was married to, any time he was the least bit unhappy about anything, or needed a self esteem boost, he was going to run to what he had taught himself would ease the hurt, or boost his ego…porn, flirting w/other women, chat rooms, etc. I may have things that any wife would need to work on and change to better my marital relationship, but he couldn’t see that I was trying to change those things, so I do feel like I failed. I feel like I was the only person in his life who finally saw who he really was, and instead of hating him, I loved him even more. I was able to look past all the stupid things he was doing to cope w/life, and see WHY he was doing those things..it was how he had self LEARNED to sooth himself. He didn’t know healthy ways to deal w/the crud life throws at you.

      So I have a hard time being upset at him on some levels, bc I see the scared little boy who did the best he could to cope w/a crummy childhood. But it breaks my heart, and makes me angry that God led him to someone who can see all of this, clearly and without hatred (although it’s taken me several years to finally get to this point of understanding)and is willing to be there for him as he finally goes back and works through all of this hurt that OTHER PEOPLE, NOT ME did to him YEARS AGO, and then learn how to cope with life and express current hurts in healthy normal ways, and he’s throwing me in the garbage. To me, he’s taking a partner God gave him to HELP him, and spitting on it, saying I’m not what he needs, he knows beter than God. Maybe I’m wrong to feel this way.

      I guess that’s why I tend to be upset at some of the therapy we tried, bc I feel like if it had been put to us this way so many years ago, instead of this maze and fog we went through, and someone had told him over and over until it he DID get it (bc we all sometimes need very direct guidance, but I think especially if you have unhealthy coping skills to begin with)that this was a result of his crappy childhood, NOT ME, OR OUR MARRIAGE, things might be so different now.

      I know he was told this once by our last therapist, but I doubt once was enough to register w/him. So again, my head very much understands he’s choosing to run away, and avoid getting healthy. He would rather run to the very people he told me for years did all this damage to him to begin with, then stay w/the one person in his life who wants those hurts to finally heal. For a long time I was angry at what he did do, now it’s going to take a while for me to get angry at what he’s refused to do. Right now I’m more hurt than angry.

      My head understands it’s easier for him to run back to the people and the patterns that are familar and easiest for him, and logically I know it’s not about me, but my heart still breaks over the fact that for years, all I’ve heard is how much everyone else in his life hurt him, and here I am, offering him forgiveness again, and wanting nothing but the best for him in a HEALTHY way, and I’m the one he is turning his back on. bc of stuff he says is unforgivable. My head is angry at him, my head gets something has changed in him, my heart doesn’t understand yet that the guy I was able to get glimpses of for so many years has faded away, and no longer exsists. I guess it’s harder than I thought it would be for me to accept that the heart I fell so madly in love with, because it was so kind and gentle, could now turn around and be so heartless to the only person who ever saw, hurt for, understood, and wanted so much for that hurt little boy inside him to finally heal.

  11. As a Christian counselor, I just felt I had to add something here. I love to see a marriage recover from this addiction and I believe God hates divorce. But when I hear women who are being abused or cheated on repeatedly use their faith as a reason to stay, I think they are lying to themselves. Do you think that is what God wants for you? MyRewardIsComing, you deserve better and God wants you to have better. If you are a woman of faith, trust in him to provide for you, and protect you as you are released from this detrimental relationship. If Christian women are struggling with the idea of divorce, consider reading the book, Divorce: God’s Will? An excellent read. I had a woman tell me that even though she had not decided whether or not to leave her husband, reading that book released her from the feelings that to divorce her husband would be a sin. She felt enpowered that she could make the decision that was best for her, without being held back by misinterpreted scriptures, or legalistic leaders in the church.

    1. Hi Ella,

      Thank you so much for your loving care and concern. That is one of the things I love so much about this website, is how all of the ladies who have also had so many of the same things happen, reach out to each other to offer their support.

      I feel I need to make clear, I was in no way planning to just let my husband just move back in, and just hope and wish things would never become physically abusive again. He is no longer living here, and couldn’t even come for a physical visit at my home, even if I had been ok w/it (which I wasn’t!). But just as I believe people can be in recovery from their sexual addiction, I do believe he also could have taken steps to be in recovery from his physical temper. That is where I believe love and forgiveness come into play.

      However, I never really got to see any evidence of that happening before he announced he wanted the divorce. So, again, my head knows he was not willing to do the work it would have taken to repair our marriage, so this divorce may be a blessing for me, but it doesn’t stop my heart from aching that this man that pledged to love and protect me, doesn’t love me enough, nor did he ever, bc if he did, there would have been no hestitaion, no excuses, I wouldn’t have heard how badly what he did affected him, I would instead have heard and seen every move on the face of the planet to show me he wanted to get his temper under control to once again become my protecter, all other things coming later.

      I don’t want it to sound like I’m saying to be a loving Christian wife, that means you should tolerate physical abuse, bc I don’t think that in any way, shape or fashion. But I do belive in seperation as a time that can be used for the abuser to get help for their anger, and steps can be taken, through therapy, medication, whatever it takes, if they really want to control their temper. It may have taken six months to staet to see a real change, it may have taken two years until I once again felt safe alone with him. This is what I felt would have worked in my situation. I think sometimes the situation is more severe, and this would not be a possibilty for all cases.

      So, as I’ve said in some of my other posts, my head very much understands he DIDN’T want to do the work to show me he wanted me to feel safe to be with him again. This man who was trying to show me he was so big and macho, and what a “man” and leader he was by hitting me, is nothing me than a big giantic chicken poop, bc he’s turning tail and running away. My head knows that, right now, he doesn’t have enough nerve in his pinky finger to show me what a real man looks like, and how big and brave he could be, by standing up and saying he will not do this to me again, and he’s willing to do whatever it takes to become a hero to me.

      Right now my heart just doesn’t understand how he could do this to me. It’s like getting hit twice, once physically, and once mentally, when he told me I didn’t matter enough to him to do this, his own selfish needs where what mattered more. My heart breaks bc that’s what he was shown as a child, so he’s doing what he learned, but I really believe there was a side to him that didn’t want to be like this, and I think for a long period of time he was happy being the husband I thought I married, I don’t think it was all lies.

      My head keeps trying to tell my heart it wasn’t me that made him turn tail and run, and refuse to stand up and be a real man, my heart just hasn’t gotten there yet. My heart still thinks I must have been a horrid wife, bc that’s what he’s telling me his reason is for running away. I hope once my heart goes through more of the grieving process, it will catch up.

      Still just very confussed as to why, if marriage is supposed to be forever, and I want that in a healthy way, not staying together in a physically abusive marriage, God isn’t laying anything on my husband’s heart, or putting anything in his path for this to happen. Instead I’m being told God is telling him to leave me, and that isn’t making any sense to me.

      Sorry, I know this isn’t a site to discuss theology, just expressing alot of the questions and thoughts I’m dealing with, hoping it may also help other ladies as I share where my heart is. Thanks!!

      1. Dear My Reward Is Coming,

        PLEASE understand in your heart and in your head that you were NOT a horrid wife. He’s lying to you. That is classic, twisted, demented, blame the victim, addict behavior. No one can measure up to the fantasy created by and in a porn addicted brain. No one. If God exists, and I really question that given what I’ve been through, He will deal with your “husband” in His time. He may very well be leaning heavily on his heart. Your “husband’s” heart may be so hard that He cannot get through right now.

        I found this posting yesterday, and it helped me even at this stage of my recovery. I hope I’m not breaking any rules by posting a link, but this is from covenant eyes, a reliable internet filtering site. Please see “Straight talk to husbands who watch porn,” here: http://www.covenanteyes.com/pureminds-articles/straight-talk-to-husbands-who-watch-porn/ There is a section in that article called “Am I not enough for him?” Please read that and take it to heart. PLEASE believe in your heart and head that you were a good wife…….probably a great wife…..and no one could have possibly met his expectation.

        My best to you, Betty

      2. Yeaaa!!!!! Yeaaaa for him!!!!!! He said you were a horrid wife!!! I love that guy!!! Who in the hyeal wants to be a perfect mate for a daggone pervert?!?

        You can wear your unsuitability as his mate as a badge of honor! You did not know how to successfully mate with a SA. Isn’t that a good thing? Wouldn’t you be upset if someone walked up to you and said, “Honey, you are the PERFECT type of woman to be married to a pervert”? How sick would you have to be to be married to a SA and be in marital bliss?

        Like you, I wasted time asking myself and counselors and him “how could he do this to me” Let me help you with the answer. How could he do it, E-A-S-I-L-Y!!! It really wasn’t that hard. You see, we delude ourselves. We formerly believed that these guys were capable of feeling love, respect, concern. We formerly believed that they were not only interested in, but also committed to something or someone other than themselves. In all honesty, they were incapable of feeling. I’m not blaming them, but the fact is they simply did not/do not feel. Remember the capacity for empathy, sympathy, love was beaten out of them. Remember they had to give up the humanness of feeling to survive in their family. It simply is not there, not anymore.

        You can continue beating yourself up, or you can admit the hard truth. Whatever they once had, they had to surrender as a cost of survival. What you want to believe would have hurt them tremendously, had little impact on them because they are like the kids who are born without physical sensation. They have no sense of feeling. If he were blind and hit you with a car, you wouldn’t ask yourself, “how could he hit me with the car?” This is the same thing. He has lost the emotional capacity to feel, so yes he can hurt you. And, it won’t bother him one bit, until he chooses to do the work to regain his emotional capacity to feel. And, he does not HAVE to do that work. It is scary work. It is hard work and the easier thing to do is just not do it.

        I don’t know what it feels like to feel nothing. Maybe its the better choice, if you believe the only alternative is walking around feeling hurt and inadequate all of the time. If I had to feel bad about myself 24 hours a day or feel nothing at all, I might choose to feel nothing at all. I don’t know. Your dude seems to be saying, he can’t do 24 hours of feeling.

      3. So very well put, Honest Wife.

        I’ve often described my SA as “emotionally blind.” He simply does not have the capacity to feel or to emote. The analogy I’ve used, to the trained therapist, is that asking him to emote is like asking a blind person to describe a color. They just don’t have the capacity.

        When you say: “They had to give up the humanness of feeling to survive in their family” I think you absolutely hit the nail on the head. I know this is what happened to my SA. His family of origin is really sick.

        Trained therapists don’t even understand this. This is so very insightful and so well put…….Thank you.

        This site is one of the best sources of support.

        My best, Betty

      4. This is so insightful that I’m going to post it, with attribution to “An Honest Wife,” in a Christian recovery forum. You’ve captured what I’ve tried to say beautifully! By the way….today is the second anniversary of finding the porn. I’m taking it easy on me today…….

        Best to all, Betty

      5. Betty,

        Can you post on here what the name of the Christian forum is?

      6. Dear My Reward,

        The Christian forum is http://www.blazinggrace.org. There is a wives section, but much of the page is dedicated to the addicts. Addicts and wives can post in any section. Exchanges sometimes get heated. I post there as “Devastated Wife” and because it is a Christian forum, I hold my tongue. I post unvarnished thoughts here. I polish them up over there. Tim M posts there quite frequently and he strikes me as an addict who is truly in recovery. I appreciate his insights into the mind of an addict. Administrator Mike is also clearly in recovery, although he does not post as often as Tim M. Truthseeker is another wife of an addict and she moderates the forum.

        My best, Betty

      7. Honest,

        You hit on so many good points. I know growing up, he played peacemaker, and I’ve seen where he wasn’t supposed to get upset as an adult around his family, so I can only imagine what it was like when he was a kid, and how much he did stuff inside. Where as I grew up in a house where you could get angry, and even yell, but never to the point of abuse, and there was never any name calling, and certiainly never physical violence.

        I remember the first time after we where married, and he knocked a hole in the wall, or threw a lamp, and I was scared out of my mind! I remember thinking “What the heck did I get myself into?!” I think back to how scared to death I was back then, and how that went from being something that scared me out of my mind, to being the norm. So, I keep reminding myself, yes, I called the police when he hit ME, but how long would it have taken for that to become his new “normal”?

        That’s part of what blows my mind so much. Years ago, he would feel like scum anytime he lost his temper, and just dented or broke an object, here he was hitting me, and now he’s acting like that escilation was no big deal, like HE was the spouse getting the raw deal. Every couple has normal problems they have to work out all the time, but he’s comparing those type of things to him hitting me??

        How could anyone slide that far downhill and not see he needs help?? That’s where I just don’t get it!! And yet most of the people who taught him all these unhealthy ways to deal w/his anger, called him names, and taught him to shove everything inside, he’s not “divorcing” any of them, or ditching them. Those are the people he’s embracing right now!

        I married someone who wanted to flee all that dysfunction like you wouldn’t believe, and for a long time, I saw him really try, which makes it so hard to believe how he could just go running right back to so much of what he hated growing up, when he has someone who was trying to deal w/things in a healthy way, and still be with him. It hurts that he’s making that kind of choice. Head gets that he thinks the work would be too hard, he’d rather ditch healthy, and act like a teenager, heart doesn’t understand how anyone could make that kind of choice.

        But like you point out Honest, I guess it’s a GOOD thing I feel the way I do, bc it means I wanted things to be HEALTHY, and mature, and I don’t understand how you could NOT want that in a relationship, so it IS a good thing none of this DOES make sense to me!

  12. My Reward—

    honey, honey, honey… Please listen… This so-called “vulnerability”??? OMG!!! is also not real. Its a CON. He suckered you in, honey, but good. He is very, very sick and all of the kings horses and all of the kings shrinks can’t put humpty pathological addict back together again. The only person you can save is YOU and for that to happen you have to move away from HIM. He will pull you down into the depths of hell if you stay–guaranteed. Some people CANNOT be helped. Some people die of disease and mental illness is no different. Sometimes the prognosis is hopeless, but in this case, he will take you down with him, if you stay. Up to you, but I hear that you want to live. Take it one step at a time.

    Any man who hits a woman— EVEN ONE TIME, is NOT A MAN!!!!!!! He’s not a hurt little boy either.

    HE’S A MONSTER and you are not safe in his presence. Men can and do kill their wives each and every day.

    So, please… for the love of God, PLEASE stop making excuses for him. He should be in prison.

    love and hugs,

    Lexie

  13. MyReward,

    You ask a lot of excellent questions and I’d like to jump in, if I may with some of my views based on my own abusive family of origin, what I’ve learned in therapy and from reading a lot on the subject. Of course, every dysfunctional family has a different dynamic. And there are many factors such as birth order, sex of the abuser and of the child, and the individual’s own constitution/psyche/neurology, (extremely important!) that they were born with, which may reveal how the child will develop and dictate the person that they will eventually become. So, while it is difficult to make blanket statements, there are some consistent behaviors that one can possibly expect from someone who has grown up in a family like this and your husband is exhibiting a typical response for a man who grew up with this kind of abuse and has not received the appropriate treatment.

    Everything that he does… the temper rages, the violence and the abusive words are learned behaviors and coping mechanisms that he used to survive his childhood. Even if he stuffed down his anger, it was still there. Furthermore, he was shown time after time after time, that THIS is how one solves conflict. Behavior modification is any behavior which is repeatedly done with the same outcome occurring whether that outcome be good or bad. However, on some level, he is also an angry man for being controlled and hurt in such a manner and anyone NOW, who tries to CONTROL HIM will be seen as a threat, no matter what. And that threat must be stopped or eliminated. Even though the sickness hurt him, it is an evil that he knows and there is comfort in that. It is completely overwhelming and incomprehensible for him to conduct himself in any other way and yet, and furthermore, he hates himself for hurting other people, because he is a “good guy” and can never be that monster that he grew up with, so, if you are hurt, it CANNOT be his fault. He cannot deal with that. THAT is why he has rejected you. He is so deathly afraid that he can never be that man for you and he can’t see his way out, so his only recourse is to make it all go away. Now, YES– if you were willing to look the other way, and stuff it all down, yourself… be a door mat, and his “whipping boy”, from the get-go, you could’ve made probably made a go of the marriage. I don’t recommend that, however, but there are women who do this all the time. I believe they are clinically known as masochists. Real and abiding love and care cannot heal him, because he does not really know what that is. Its foreign and feels completely suffocating to him.

    Another thing is that victims of abuse, in an entirely subconscious level, will often take great pains to “recreate the abuse”, so that they can NOW– finally heal themselves as adults. And yes its totally f**ked up and hugely so, but for a victim, it feels “healing”. Imagine if all of your life, you lived in a hot, tropical climate and all of your life, you wore very little clothing. Then suddenly you flew to Alaska in January… Your entire being would be thrown into shock! That is how it is for him. And even sadder, it is almost always a propagating, cycle that is handed down from generation to generation.

    His father was abused and his father and his father… just like that…

    next??????

    Can the cycle be broken? Yes, it can, but it takes a lot of work and years of it and it needs to start before the children are born! And there has to be some awareness, that he needs the help and the knowledge that its possible to change and to grow. Without that, in place, I’m afraid the prognosis is very grim.

    It wasn’t until I had my own children, that I began to fully understand how it all works… and also, just how sick my childhood really was! And believe you me, it took every fiber of my being not to fall into those familiar patterns, but I was also given two children that would drive just about any parent into the loony bin. (my sick joke is that I’ve been spit roast fucked on both ends– LOL) I have said a thousand times. “If they had been born to my family of origin, they would’ve been dead, a long time ago.” I was terrified to have children, but I had been in therapy for years already and worked on my anger issues which is a life-long, on-going process.

    Bottom line. Right now, your husband is a freight train doing what freight trains do. You know that if he could go back and be the bicycle he was pretending to be when you met him that things could be so much better and naturally, you cannot understand how he doesn’t see this too? And even though you know for certain that a bicycle is healthier and better for the environment too, and could bring him a better life, in time, he has never even seen one before (in person) and he has no understanding of how being a bicycle would really work for him, being a freight train and all. All he really knows is being a freight train… barreling down the tracks– if he happens to hit something along the way… Well, they should’ve known better!!! I’m a freight train!!! Geeezzz… Of course, he pretends sometimes to be a bicycle, because he saw in a movie somewhere that this is what freight trains do on this planet, and he saw some other freight train being a bicycle, but its all so weird and foreign. He cannot sustain it! But he heard that if he wanted to attract the attention of a pretty woman…(all on a subconscious level, BTW) that he better “be a bicycle”… but then… it feels “fake” to him and he goes back into the familiar which is the true him. A freight train.

    That’s the only way I can explain it. Its not your fault and there’s nothing else you could’ve done to change the outcome, short of selling your own soul.

    I’m really sorry that this happened to you. Yes, he should’ve come with warnings.

    BIG SIGN:

    Danger Ahead!!!!!!!!!! railroad X-ING — proceed with GREAT caution–FREIGHT TRAIN!!!

    The only viable option if one wants to stay safe… is to stay out of its way.

    All my best,

    Lexie

    1. Lexie,

      You hit the nail on the head in so many ways!! I had shared w/one of the therapists that all of his life he kept hearing everything he did was wrong, when in fact (according to him), it wasn’t. So he HATED hearing he did anything wrong, even when he did things that WHERE WRONG, like hitting me. I was supposed to feel bad and empathize w/the fact he spent a night in jail, but he couldn’t stand to hear what that night felt like for me, bc it made him feel even worse. He also mentioned a few times that I shouldn’t have cared so much about him after what he did to me. So, rather than embrace the fact he has a wife who is willing to look past what happened, and try to salvage the marriage in a healthy way, he pushed me away bc he had no clue how to deal with this.

      I was either supposed to hate him, and never speak to him again, or just let him return home, and act like nothing happened. This person telling him she still loved him, but not his actions, and those ACTIONS needed to be corrected, but I still saw value in him, was probably something his brain could not deal with, bc he’d never seen that before. But on the flip side, I had this same reaction when I saw his temper emerge early in our marriage, he got help and controlled the rages for several years, that’s why I’m so stumped why getting back on track is causing him to run, instead of getting back on track again. Maybe bc now I know about the SA, or tendancies, whereas I didn’t know about them back then, so that was one less thing he had to face.

      That’s where I do feel let down so much by therapy, bc you just explained everything so well in a few paragraphs, what therapists never would. That’s what makes this all so sad for me, is I am finally starting to put so much of all of this together, so I can see where things I may have done needed to be approached a different way, while he worked out all of those old childhood issues. But no one ever gave us that type of help, we where always thrown into a cookie cutter pile.

      I can’t help but wonder what might have happened if any of the therapists had told us what you just described Lexie, but then followed it up, explaining to him repeatedly, this wasn’t going to be a quick fix, but would take time, and that while he worked on his family of origion issues, they would retrain BOTH of us to communicate with each other differently, bc “normal” didn’t work w/him. In someway that I was heard, but I didn’t trigger him to see me as a threat, and he didn’t get to just bury everything, hoping it would all go away. (Wishful thinking, bc he never may have been able to do that!)

      I think we might have been on the edge of finally getting there when he bolted. How can you be that close, and then just throw it all away?? Yes, logic tells me if he really wanted to do the work, he’d still be trying, but again, my heart doesn’t understand that logic right now…hopefully it will after I grieve all this.

      I love his family, just not how they treated him, and I saw him want to escape that. It’s like he couldn’t connect that he could learn to be w/his family and not fall back into the old ways. I couldn’t for the life of me understand why the first few times I was around them while we dated, I saw my husband act like a total stranger, and treat me in ways he never treated me otherwise. But I always blew it off, thinking it was just me, but from all the reading I’ve done now, it sounds pretty typical of SA’s, but back then I just remember wondering why he did that. He would always apologize on the way home, but after awhile, I came to expect it, and it became our “normal”.

      I do know since so much that once sent off tiny red flags for me, had become the “norm”, it was only going to get worse, so my head is trying to see some sort of blessing by hubby bailing, but my heart just doesn’t understand yet why or how he can throw us away, and not want to do all he can to save us, and himself. Yes, I know, trying to make sense of the senseless!

    2. Lexi, I love that comparison! Freight train wishing to be a bicycle.

      Sanity: Yes, how they need to be with women as morally bankrupt as themselves. Little emotionally damaged, wooden boys playing with little emotionally damaged, wooden girls. It is like our society keeps creating each of them so the wooden boys will have wooden girls to play with, and the cycle endures.

      My Reward: Yes, perhaps we could have learned to communicate with them. But is it our job, or life’s work, to twist ourselves up in order to fit their mold? Like yours, mine had been through therapy before. They knew there were tools out there they could use. They chose not to. They chose the addiction. Even though they might not have known what healthy felt like, they knew damn well they weren’t living it but didn’t want to change.

      There are reasons so many movies display a mama’s boy as dangerous. We, who come from mothers’ where the entire family wants to run away from her craziness, mistake a man’s devotion to his mother as meaning his family was better. We offer him a grace that is unwaranted out of ignorance, and that feeds his addiction as well as fear of us feeds his addiction. The fallacy that he can love, and respect, real women. We don’t comprehend the underlying disease process between overly bonded mother, and the consequences of a boy who never learned to be his own man, and who loves/hates/fears/obsesses/fixates/destroys his mother through us, through a fantasy of escape, by controlling prostitutes, through paying for women to tell him whatever he wants to hear and stroke his weak and wounded ego. I read once that their mother is their true love, and we are the mistress he feels guilty for replacing her with, and so punishes himself and us for being unfaithful to his mother. That fits, too.

      They are humans, in one of the more damaged forms. Layers of issues, layers of coping mechanisms, layers of love and hate and corrupted wiring.

      I do not believe most of us were as damaged coming into these marriages. But I imagine we are equally damaged coming out of them.

  14. My Reward,

    I know… its a difficult, lengthy process to understand or to second ourselves or if we could’ve done anything any differently to affect a different outcome. But I truly feel that you did everything you could and that he is one of the more unhealthy ones who is so impaired, so damaged, that he will unfortunately go through the rest of his life like this and will most likely continue to deteriorate. You could’ve had Dr. Joyce Brothers, counseling him lol and I can assure you, it wouldn’t have made one iota of difference.

    And to add to the pain, he will most likely find another woman to latch onto (narcissists can’t stand to be alone) and it might happen very quickly, (if he doesn’t already have someone). Don’t worry, she will soon be miserable too, or else she will sell her soul. Those are the only two choices available, and neither one, I’m afraid is very pretty.

    I’m really sorry that he did this to you, but the reality is that these relationships are doomed from the start because a man like this cannot sustain ANY truly intimate relationships. It is impossible. Its his way or the hi-way and yes, it absolutely sucks because we feel so duped and we were! So feel good knowing that you are a wonderful woman who’s deserving of the kind of man you thought you had, but did not. Please know that your heart was true and he doesn’t have the capacity or understanding to appreciate your valiant efforts to save, not only your marriage but him, too. He does not want this. He was expecting you to be a nice little wifey-poo/door mat… but only on HIS terms. yechh…

    Good riddance!

    xo,

    Lexie

    1. Dear Lexie,

      You said: “…you are a wonderful woman who’s deserving of the kind of man you thought you had…”

      That should be a daily affirmation for every woman who is married to a sex addict. We should say that to ourselves until we believe it and take action on it.

      My best to you, Betty

  15. MyReward,

    Even had you been Miss Universe and Mother Teresa rolles into one ,believe me , it wouldnt have made any difference whatsoever.

    The healthier , emotionally spiritually morally , you are the more the SAs run from you.

    They are comfortable with women who are morally bankrupt coz that is when they can be themselves.

    With a prostitute or a stripper he doesnt have to pretend to be incorruptible the way he has to pretend with us.

    Just imagine how “stressful” it would be for them to be with women like us.

    If we want them with us we have to be like them.

    As Lexie says..either turn a blind eye or sell our souls.

    And believe me , sometimes the temptation to do that is there.

    Just get out before you accept that as the new normal.

    Sanity

  16. Ladies,

    OK, I had all this typed out, and then my computer goofed and deleted everyting, so I’ll try again..lol!!

    My husband had said a few weeks ago he would be willing to work as much as poassible about the divorce as possible between the two of us to keep costs down and wanted it to be as painless as possible for me. I’m still very hurt over how all of this happened, and I’ve expressed to him I don’t understand how he can do this, nor will I ever understand how he can just run away from me. thinking that will make his issues disappear!

    I’ve asked him for some more time to see what the government is going to do w/disability benefits, can he hold off for a while bc of my situation, and I reminded him that my family always was more than willing to help him out when he needed it, and that I could have just told him to move back home, and pretended everything was just fine, when it wasn’t, but I tried to get us healthy, so can he please wait for a while?

    He won’t even answer me! He won’t say anything, so I have no clue what is going on, after what he said a few weeks ago. I’m afraid now he’s going to try to use what I said when I was so hurt as something against me. I could understand if he said he wanted time to think about it, but he won’t even say one way or the other if he’ll even think about it.

    I don’t get it. I have been reading stuff on abusive relationships and narsassist people, and it scares me that people like him can flip things so well to take the heat off of them, and make it look like I’m the abuser, when I just would like a simple answer! Now I’m afraid every hurt feeling I ever expressed to him over all of this is going to be used against me.

    Has anyone else gone through a divorce w/an SA/Abuser that was always able to deflect and turn everything around?? I told the last therapist I know what we had wasn’t “normal” and I wanted to figure out how to let go of so many of the things I had found myself doing, as “police” that I would have never done before all this came out. I was willing to say I had to change some things, which is more than I got from him, I got blamed for everything he did.

    I am still in therapy trying to figure out what was “real”, bc I have no clue anymore, bc everyting seems so slanted so I looked like the unhealthy one who wanted too much was too demanding, etc, and now the entire legal process has me scared to death he’ll continue to do that.

    Anyone been through a divorce w/an SA that had the same feeling or experience?

  17. My Reward,

    First of all, you are afraid of HIM? I am sitting here wracking my morning-I-haven’t-had-coffee-yet-fuzzy-brain how this can be so. This is the guy who has a police record and spent time in jail because he thought it a good move to bash you over the head, and destroy your home and personal property????????? I’m sorry, but try as he may, there is absolutely nothing that he can say that will make you look badly, even IF you hit him back,(in self defense) even IF you told him in PRINT that he’s a lying c**k su*king motherfu**ing whore. There is nothing that you could possibly say that will make you look like anything but a victim of physical and emotional abuse and mental cruelty.

    The abuse began early on in your marriage and I understand that perhaps you have become desensitized to it or something and you still loved him. I’m very glad that you are seeing a therapist. I was an abused child and it takes a long time to understand that it was HIM, not you that was the problem. Even if you get it intellectually.

    Honey, if he wants out, for whatever the reason and believe me, his reasons don’t matter. Count your blessings. This is the kindest most honorable thing he is capable of. He does not wish to be well. He does not wish to fight for what is good and loving, because he does not know what that is. He is not a REAL person. He’s a dangerous sociopath and the only solution if you wish to remain alive for your natural time on this good earth, is to get away from him–ASAP.

    Please say to yourself over and over as often as you can.

    “my husband is a dangerous sociopath and I need to get as far away from him as possible, as soon as possible.”

    Do you have a lawyer? If so, speak to your husband through your lawyer.

    DO NOT SPEAK TO YOUR HUSBAND. At least, not any more than necessary. Don’t argue with him. Don’t expect ANYTHING of him. Do not ask him for any favors or consideration. nothing. Just get IN, get ON, and GET OUT! (to quote one of my favorite lines from “The Court Jester”)

    Do not attach any quid pro quo notions… “my family helped him, now he should help me, kind of thinking.”

    He is a sociopath. The ONLY person he cares about is HIMSELF. He has his own (f**ked up) rules and HIS rules are designed to make him look good and you look bad, no matter how absurd or illogical or hurtful or what he once said. Nothing that comes outta his fekked up mouth can be believed, even if per chance he is telling the truth. He lies to himself too. He’s not a playing with a full deck.

    And its his way or the hi-way. so, GOOD RIDDANCE!

    Don’t try to make any sense out of it. Thank God, that he has found a way to release you from this monster.

    Go to your Church and ask for help, if all else fails. Ask for help in any way that you can, from any resource which is available to help abused, battered women, or any resource period. If you need help, until you can get back up on your feet through the government, ask for help from family or friends. That’s what they are for. Good people WANT to help. That is what is normal. Not the idiot that you married.

    You are a battered, abused woman, and there is help out there for you, for free.

    There is also help and advice for free on the internet for women who are divorcing a narcissist/sociopath.

    put in quotes: “divorcing a sociopath” and then, “help for battered women” in your google search engine.

    But please feel free to come here and vent and rail and say what a horrible SOB he is, all you want.

    Get your anger out here, not with him.

    If you must speak to him, pretend that he is a 95 year old man with advancing Alzheimer’s. Speak slowly and carefully and with love and kindness in your heart for someone who will soon be dead.

    I’m really sorry that you have to go through this, but after it is over, you will be free…free of this oppression and free to find your true self and I promise one day, in the not-too-distant future, you will look back and you will not believe how far you have come.

    Love,

    Lexie

    1. Hi Lex,

      I don’t think I made this very clear, when I was asking him for more time before he went through w/the divorce, I meant w/him living where he is now, NOT moving back home….gee whiz no! Pretty much just staying married on paper, which my lawyer has said she sees alot since my state doesn’t offer seperation. That’s all I was asking for.

      And I want to make clear, he didn’t beat me, he slapped me w/all his might, and he’s a big guy, and had badly bruised my arm before. I’m not saying that’s any “better”, or excusable at all, I just don’t want to make it sound like he beat the crud out of me. And I’m not at all saying that was no big deal, bc it was, I just don’t want to put myself in the same league as woman who have had to edure real beatings, bc I can’t even begin to imagine that horror!

      You would be suprised at the legal response I’ve gotten. Bc it took the police a while to arrive, there was no mark left, so it was a lower offense. If I had reported the bruise, he would have gotten in more trouble, so it’s almost as if that stuff doesn’t seem to matter to the courts.

      My case is very complicated bc of some other issues, trying to get support, and the legal aid I spoke w/didn’t seem very experienced in that issue, only the domestic violence. So I had to hire someone, which is why I was trying to work the smaller stuff like household stuff out between us.

      I try very hard to keep an open mind when someone reminds me what the “right” thing is to do from a moral standpoint, I don’t take offense at all. So I didn’t think twice about asking him to consider this option, reminding him when kindness was shown to him. And if someone hurts me that is a friend/family member, I don’t bottle things inside, so it still floors me that he gets so offended if I express hurt, or remind him of human kindness.

      Logically I know he doesn’t care what he’s doing to me, or what he did, it’s just still so illogical to me that I can’t express those things to him, bc that seems so abnormal to me. I am really trying to turn back to my faith, for reminders and support, but then it scares me when I see him able to twist everything around so well to make me look unreasonable bc he doesn’t fit some “profile”, so of course if that’s what I’m being told, then I question myself again, and it’s like this never ending yoyo, as I watch everyone feel bad for him.

      When I say I still pray for our marriage, I mean I pray for it to come to restoration in a healthy way, w/something finally clicking in him, that he has work to do to restore a real life for himself, I don’t mean that I want a husband back that’s just going to do it all over again. Yes, I know the odds are 99% that would never happen even if he tried, but I’ve also read a few success stories on here, and THAT is what I pray for.

      That doesn’t mean I’m not trying to do things for myself to get through this, bc I am. That’s why it helps to hear stories from other women as to how they got through a divorce if there was no other option, when you are dealing w/am addict.

      That’s why I’m glad I found this site for support.

  18. Reward,

    I feel so badly for you…

    “And I want to make clear, he didn’t beat me, he slapped me w/all his might, and he’s a big guy, and had badly bruised my arm before.”

    That actually made me sick to my stomach. So, he’s a big guy who slapped you with all of his might??? Really? And you want to be sure that I didn’t think he was BEATING you? I don’t care if he beat you, or shoved you, or slapped you across the room… A man who lays his hands on a woman with anything but the gentlest of touches is NOT a man. Husbands kill their wives with their bare hands each and every day. The fact that you didn’t report when he bruised your arm doesn’t make it not true and it doesn’t make him less of a monster.

    He is a monster.

    “my husband is a dangerous sociopath and I need to get as far away from him as possible, as soon as possible.”

    These violent behaviors ESCALATE and the next time, he might break your arm or your jaw… or your neck. Think not? Over 1,300 women are killed each year by their husbands, ex-husbands, or boyfriends in this country.

    As for the rest… Look, I know… its very, very difficult to understand. Let’s put it this way. He is two people.

    Dr. Jekyl

    and

    Mr. Hyde.

    When he is Dr. Jekyl, he can be a pretty darned nice guy, charming, affable, helpful… but he cannot sustain this. When he is under any kind of stress and you may not even realize this, or see the impending volcano, but at any moment, he can blow up like Mt. Vesuvius– and then big green evil monster shows up, in place of where your husband used to be.

    Is he going to change?

    No.

    The husbands and there are very, very few on here who do…and many of the so-called recovering addicts, are merely more clever at hiding their activities. this is the truth. But the very few who are in recovery are in INTENSIVE and I mean 3-5 days a week, of intensive therapies and 12-step programs and they are moving heaven and earth to make it up to their spouses. The only thing I see him doing, is making your life more and more miserable. His addictions and pathology are only worsening, not getting better.

    There is no hope. We have released him to “hospice care”. The jig is up.

    Do you understand?

    He cannot change, because part of his brain is actually missing and he cannot change what isn’t there, to begin with.

    Here is a great forum I found for you which supports everything I have said.

    http://www.lisaescott.com/forum/2010/01/05/why-does-he-abuse-me

    I’m sorry honey. He is not capable of being the kind of husband that you want and deserve. There is absolutely ZERO chance of this. And all of the praying and keeping faith cannot change this fact. The only thing your faith CAN do is to help you; help you to be strong, to grow and to recover. That will be your success story. Do you understand? This is about saving what’s left of you. The support here is for you. We are not here to support women who stays in a relationship with a wife batterer. Yes, HE IS A WIFE BATTERER. That is not support; that is enabling of a very sick and twisted situation and that is not what this site is about. Sometimes, the right course, is not the one we were planning on taking or even want to take. It becomes a matter of there being no other choice if one wishes to stay alive. And yes, it is that serious.

    Please stay safe.

    hugs and love,

    Lexie

    1. Lexie,

      When I said he “only” slapped me, I know what he did was HORRID! There was NO excuse for what he did! What I was trying to get across by saying that, was that I did not want to put myself into the same amount of suffering as the women who are beaten all the time by their husbands. I wasn’t trying to minimize it from HIS standpoint at all, bc I don’t care that it didn’t leave some sort of mark, I still think he should have had to spend much more than one night in jail for hitting me. And my pain, both physical and mental, from that is very, very real. But I can’t even begin to imagine, on any level, what women who are having things like that, and much worse done to them all the time by their husbands, are going through and that’s all I was trying to get at.

      And yes, I GET he’s not going to change. I’ve gotten that lound and clear since the day he dumped me in the therapit’s office. I GET all the things you said. That doesn’t mean I don’t still love the “good guy” I fell in love with and thought I was married to for so long, and that’s why it’s going to take time for me to come to terms with, and greive the fact “that guy” isn’t coming back. The therapist and I agree the good guy in him was there at some level, which is why this is so hard for me to move on from. I’m having to grieve this just like any other death. I think if all I ever do is focus on the SA in him who is mean, evil, and only cares about himself, than I will spend the rest of my life feeling stupid and taken that I didn’t see more of that part of him, and I’ll never get through this. But if I let myself remember all the good things I saw (whether they where real or not), than I can forgive myself for falling so deeply in love with someone who did do all the mean and nasty things he did to me. Then maybe I can move on with some sort of peace for myself.

      I am scared to death thinking about how badly I’m going to get screwed over in this divorce, which is why I’m trying to see if anyone can give me any advice from that standpoint, just bc nothing in this whole mess, nothing has worked in my favor, so to say.

      I love that you care so much about all of us on here, just as I love all the ladies who are trying to figure out life after being involved with an SA!

      1. Ladies,

        If any of you out there are praying ladies, I’m asking for your prayers. My soon to be ex is making this a very nasty divorce. He has drug his feet on everything he is supposed to be providing from his end, which only ends up costing me more $ I really don’t have right now. He is going to fight giving me any kind of long term help, & now he is saying he only “lightly slapped me” bc I’m a hysterical person. I can’t believe this! No matter what he does, he always comes out smelling like a rose. Now on top of being heartbroken that he’s leaving me for another woman, I’m having to endure this pain that he would have had to beat the snot out of me for what he did to be taken seriously by the courts. I feel like I am in the middle of a living nightmare. Right now I feel very lost and alone, bc every time I turn around, no matter what I do, he seems to comes out that what he’s done is no big deal. I can’t get my brain to wrap around the concept that this is the same man I married. He was so sweet & loving & caring. I don’t even know how to get through this anymore. I am a very stong person, but this is almost more than I can take. Please keep me in your thoughts that he will not be able to get away w/this. All I want is to not have to worry about my health concerns when he is out of my life.

      2. Dear My Reward Is Coming, I AM a praying person, and I am holding you in my prayers… Hang in there – I know it’s hard to do, but you WILL come out OK in the end. Thinking of you and sending you strength, Liza

      3. Thanks Liza! I’m still very fearful, but it’s support & prayers from ladies like you and others on here that are helping me hang on to get through this.

  19. I just came across this blog and it feels good to know that I’m not alone. I have been with my SA husband for 5 yrs. I knew before we got married that he was an addict, but he seemed so committed to working it out, that by the time we got married, it felt like our relationship was the best it had ever been.

    Six months ago, I got the rug pulled out from under me. This loving marriage I thought I was in is a lie. He told me things that made my stomach turn. I threw up. And yet I stayed to work things out. He has bad back problems and I spent 2 months learning how to massage for him. One of the things he told me six months ago was that all my effort only made him want to go pay a prostitute for erotic massages. Fast forward to yesterday. He asked me to give him a massage and I said no because there was a point in time when I did and it went unappreciated. He got mad and stormed out. He refused to talk to me. When he did, we got into a yelling match because he is so insensitive to my feelings. He’s playing the role of the victim because he says I bring up his past mistakes just to hurt him, and he doesn’t think that my lingering pain about these events is valid.

    I can only do so much. His denial is so deep. The finger always gets pointed at me. I am willing to take responsibility for my reactions and behaviors, but he never takes responsibility for his. I am ready to end it but am very scared of what it will do to me emotionally and financially. Do things get better, or is it better to get out of it now before I waste another 5 yrs of my life?

    1. Hi there,
      Things don’t get better. They just continue to suck your energy out of your life, with no results, just a lot of blaming you and excuses.
      I think they have a better chance of recovery if you leave them. Then they don’t have their “cover” and they dont’ have the person they can blame.

  20. Diane is right. They do not get better and yes, my h is exactly the same in terms of making himself out to be the victim when he does things like leave incriminating evidence around that retraumatizes me. I’m so sorry that you are in this situation.

    1. I just came across this blog. I just went to my first “alone” session with the sex therapist. I left there feeling worse about my situation, my husband and marriage than before. I question, why am I dealing with this? My husband has now admitted to being a SA and is also going to the same therapist. He seems to have hit “rock bottom” but who knows. Who knows if he’s telling the truth. Who knows if he’s just not trying to cover it up and acting like he wants to recover. I am so confused. I read these stories about how they don’t get better. I guess there is no hope of things ever getting better. So, maybe I should give up and end this marriage. Why bother if they never change? I’m so angry, hurt, upset, fed-up with it all.